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TSOALR - The Forum » View topic - Codex marines now cheesy?

Codex marines now cheesy?

Moderators: Selezen, cog[nitive]

3
16%
3
16%
11
58%
2
11%
 
Total votes : 19

Postby bigkr88 » Thu Mar 23, 2006 8:51 pm

A friend of mine was talking about how he won a knife fight on counterstrike by throwing a grenade. Another friend says, "Who brings a grenade to a knife fight?"
"The winner."
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Postby WraithVX » Fri Mar 24, 2006 12:33 pm

I can agree with that. Although I have never, ever seen this "On a 1 you can't do anything" rule. So either our local DA player is cheating, or it got removed...

In my opinion, you can't really complain about the cost of bikes for DA. If they're expensive for Marines then DA too, surely. That and Turbo boosting for a 3+ invulnerable is always fun.

I myself think that they've lost more in that Marines can get as much Plasma as them now, which also seemed to be a defining feature.
"It does not think
It does not feel
It does not laugh nor cry

All it does
From dusk 'til dawn
Is watch the soldiers
Die"
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Postby bigkr88 » Fri Mar 24, 2006 7:17 pm

the rule is on a 1 the squad can't move in the movement or assault phase... you get the whole damn-near-fearless rule if you roll a 1, but when you make lists like me and the squad have that special ability anyways, it's just a big drawback. especially when you have got move to get out of los of a russ :cry:

the rule is called 'intractable' if you wanna ask him about it. it might be one of those things he's never noticed before, i remember a couple games when i first started playing DA where i forgot about it completely, or he plays ravenwing (whom the rule doesn't apply to). I do know the rule didn't get removed in the DA faq :(

You have a point about the turbo-boosting, very useful... not against a guardsman army, though. 3+ invulnerable saves don't matter when they fire 50+ lasguns (i'm still trying to learn to use my bike boys correctly)

And I forgot to mention the plasma thing. The plasma cannon, #2 best heavy weapon imho, is no longer DA only. now everyone gets it... mildly frustrating, considering that's the ONLY heavy weapon the BA player i mentioned earlier uses.
A friend of mine was talking about how he won a knife fight on counterstrike by throwing a grenade. Another friend says, "Who brings a grenade to a knife fight?"
"The winner."
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Postby Epistolary_Zadkiel » Sat Mar 25, 2006 2:15 am

Ah, but the Dark Angels are the ONLY Space Marine Force (not sure if Chaos can or not) who are able to equip Plascannons onto their Dreadnoughts, so not only do you get a mobile, all around ass kicking artillery platform, you also get a close combat unit (unless you go with missile launchers, which seems redundent when using a plas cannon) who can kill stuff *fast*. Of course, in order to take advantage of this wonderful trait of the Dark Angels Dreadnought, you can ONLY get the Plasma Cannon part through Forgeworld. I spent probably 2 hours scouring and searching and auguring the GW site for a plasma cannon for the Space Marine Dreadnought, but it kept insisting that I was *actually* looking for a Devastator Plasma Cannon, or a Chaos Dreadnought Plas Cannon. Oh, and in case any of you aren't aware, that plasma cannon from Forgeworld... 10 dollars.

Still, the look on my buddies face when he opened the brown shoe box i had wrapped in newspaper, and found a fully painted Dark Angels Dreadnought (including the Mail Order only Dark Angels Dreadnought Torso) with plasma cannon, assault cannon, lascannon, Close Combat weapon with heavy flamer, and missile launcher all painted up and decal'd out... it was worth the 60 dollars it cost me to make. He had just bought a Dark Angels Tactical Squad, so I thought I'd help him get into the hobby and got him that. Of course, they likely won't be finished till 2015 because he also has a 3500 point Lizardman army that needs assembling, priming and painting (he got them for free from his bro, whom he helped on his game store's opening day. The store is in Minnieapolis, Minnesota... need to find out the name, in case I ever find myself in that area ¬,¬)

Anyways *drags his post back on topic* I have found that Space Marines, while being good at just about everything, are inefficient killing machines overall. Look at the 'nids. Get them in close with ANYTHING and the anything dies. Tau, the masters of "Push the red button and they die before getting to you" tactic employed by our very own M1A1 Abrams crews. Orks can simply overwhelm space marines with sheer numbers if they can get in close. IG do the same from a distance. Marines are a require a grasp of strategy and forethought that I have not often witnessed. They are one of the most adapatable armies around, but if yolu don't kit them out properly, and then use what little forces you have wisely, you are wasting your time unless your opponent is even worse at the game than you (which happens to be my case.)
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Postby ArchDuke of Macragge » Sun Mar 26, 2006 12:23 am

The thing about that is, is that even though the Specialty chapters can be used right to be mega-powered, look at the following-

-EC costs 90pts, mandatory
-I can get a 6+ invuln for all my men, but at the cost of any cover saves. Besides, there is a chapter trait that does this.
-No devestators
-No regular Land Raiders as transports
-basic troops are 16pts
-scouts are spectacuarly useless, except as combat meatshields

Know, there are advantages, like fearless in close combat, CC gear for free, etc, but they can be difficult, espicially because Chaplains are rather more expensive.

This is not a debate about the power of variant chapters, so I will shut up know.
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Postby WraithVX » Sun Mar 26, 2006 5:52 am

I'd like to bring back the Plasma Cannon on dreadnought point, actually. As an owner of the Imperial Armour books, it has come to my attention that *any* chapter may take the Cannon on their dreads. (You can also give it twin-linked heavy bolters or autocannons, but those aren't so cool). (Plus venerable dreads get WS BS and A upgraded for an extra 30 points.)

And you say it can kill stuff in CC fast?! Say that when it gets charged by 30 Boyz, four of which have Burnas.Now consider it has two attacks a round. Hitting on 4's? Averages state that it would take him *35* turns to kill them all! And even if you're always rolling really well it's still going to take ages. Now consider it's 50 Grots, or 50 conscripts with a Power-fist wielding Commisar... The Dread is pretty much out of the game.
"It does not think
It does not feel
It does not laugh nor cry

All it does
From dusk 'til dawn
Is watch the soldiers
Die"
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Postby ArchDuke of Macragge » Sun Mar 26, 2006 9:57 am

You use a dreadnaught to kill tanks in CC.
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Postby t3h C47B0Y » Tue Apr 04, 2006 2:35 pm

"God's in his heaven, all's right with the world."
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